February 02, 2010

Haggling Can Be Fun

But you have to make the effort.

Take me, for instance. I slaved over a letter to the taxman. Then I had to find an envelope, whack a stamp on it, and post if off. It all took...minutes. That saved me £300.

Emboldened, and a little excited, I penned another missive. This also took several minutes. This time I saved £1,100.

My original "debt" was £4,300. That is now reduced to £2,900.

I reckon two more letters should do it. One went off just moments ago. I will let you know if that further reduces my "debt".

There are Doubting Thomases (and Thomasinas) out there. You slagged me off. You called me a freeloader. You told me (rather unkindly, I thought) that I was full of shit. You told me that big burly men would smash down my door and cart me off for intimate moments with Big Vern in cell 49B. No visits to report. Not even so much as a nasty letter. Nothing. Zip. Nada.

Care to apologise yet?

All I did was to write two simple letters drawing attention to existing statutes. I asked for proof that my "debt" is legal or lawful. Plainly, they can not provide that evidence. In an act of appeasement, the taxman shaved off over 25% of this alleged debt. I think that they think that I will now cheer, punch the air, and shout "RESULT!". I will do no such thing. I will await the letter from them that says "Look, Ranty, we have searched high and we have searched low, and we just cannot find any excuse, legal, lawful, or otherwise, to justify us taking your money like this. We have therefore zeroed your "debt" and we will never bother you again, you wily rascal".

It may not say exactly that, it may just say something meaningless with a zero at the bottom. That will do me.

My "Just Say No" campaign continues*. Remember to say it nicely though. Remember also that you have to remove any controversy by offering to pay the "debt" conditionally. The conditions make all the difference in the world. You need proof that a contract (with two wet signatures-yours and theirs-actually exists) and if they can find one and send you a copy, then pay the "debt".

If they can't.....

Well then, you must politely decline to make payment.

If the guy two doors down from you banged on your door and said "Oi! You owe me 2 grand", would you pay him? Or would you say "For what? When did I agree to pay you 2 grand?". If he can offer no proof that you promised to pay him, you would naturally ask him to bugger off.

That's all we are doing here. We are asking for proof that the "debt" exists, and if it does, we are merely asking to see the contract. Would a judge uphold the neighbours demand for cash without a contract being in place? I think not. How many judges would side with a government demanding monies from you without evidence that you willingly agreed to pay? Sadly, the answer is "Most of them". They are on the same team. Why would they rule otherwise? Even knowing the demands, often with menaces and threats, are unlawful? Courts do not dispense justice, and they certainly do not deal with the law. They are bankers. They are there to extract cash, or, at a push, separate you from your liberty for a time. Even the word "bench" when translated into French becomes "banque" so why do we insist on telling ourselves that courts exist for some noble purpose? They don't. They collect money for HMG. We should rename the courts. We should call them what they are: Accounts Payable.

Enough lecturing. Let's wait some more to see what they come up with next. I still have more tools in the box, so if the screwdriver doesn't work, I'll use the spanner, and if that fails, I will reach for the hammer. They are all metaphorical, of course.

The only tool I actually possess is a pen.

It seems to be working rather splendidly.


* I remind you again that I am not offering advice. This blog is for your entertainment. Whilst the subject matter is intensely personal to me, I do not expect (nor counsel you) to imitate my actions. Any risks I take are my own. My choice. My responsibility.


Jim said...

I admire your balls in dealing with HMRC like that. I'm afraid I wouldn't sleep well at night if I did the same.

Incidentally, are we talking normal income tax liability here - ie a 'I had £10k of income therefore I 'owe' them £2K' type scenario? Or are you saying you didn't have the income in the first place?

Captain Ranty said...


To begin with it was a case of not wanting to pay what I saw as a huge chunk of my money in corporation tax despite already paying them income tax at 40%, plus employee NICs, plus employer NICS (I was a one man band, essentially salaried, but thanks to Euro regulations, I had to form a Ltd company). So yes, I did have the income but I thought I had already paid more than my fair share but they came back for more.

Now though, I have discovered that national and international law contains within it a remedy that says I can not only cease paying tax, but that I can claim all my taxes back from March 2003 to date.

Did you know that Income Tax is really an Emergency Tax that gets re-ratified by a special committee every year? It has been this way since the end of the war in 1945. It's the same in the USA.

No-one ever questioned it.

Until now.

The battle isn't over, and between you and me, they won't lose any sleep over my poxy four grand. They don't need it.

They may feel the need to slap me around a bit, but I am ready.


Uncle Marvo said...

The more you pay them the more they keep coming back.

I'd like to know what kind of sicko works for them, actually.

Snakey said...

I was watching the Dan Snow Empire of the Seas from last Friday and he showed a document from about the time of Trafalgar, bringing in income tax as an 'emergency' measure to pay for more navy ships to be built. Of course, this 'emergency' act appears to have never have been repealed (something I didn't know until recently).

Captain Ranty said...


Come on, mate! You know how the human psyche works. Give 'em a little power and they will use it until it (or you) bleeds....


Captain Ranty said...


I may have been hasty using 1945. I also recall that this abomination goes back further than we think.

It became the norm.

I want to un-norm it.

If I succeed, I shall want a pint from ALL of you!


Lost said...

Go, Cap'n

Had no idea this stuff could work within a Ltd company.

Just assumed the contract was established when I incorporated. I really need to catch up.

ee/er NIC's & Corp tax, that alone is astonishing, where do you get your info? I poke about in tpuc and alike quite often but, have never seen anything to help a Ltd company.

Any-ways good stuff, keep at em.
The pints a given btw.


Captain Ranty said...


Please note that I am not doing this with an active company*.

To be fair, I never tried this stuff when I was trading because I was unaware of it.

My Ltd company ceased trading on 31 Dec 2008, so they are chasing payment for 2007/2008. I gave them a ton of money in 2006/2007 so as far as I am concerned they really have to show me proof of contract, or that Section 2 of the International Criminal Court (Scotland) Act 2001 and the Charter of the Nuremberg Tribunal 1950 are meaningless.

I don't think I am asking too much. They, on the other hand, are.

* If I were trying to settle my debts differently with HMRC, (with an active, trading Ltd company) I would do it using A4V (Accepting for Value). This also, is a lawful remedy to settle outstanding payments to government agencies.


Lost said...

Thanks for the clarification and food for thought Cap'n.

Antipholus Papps said...

This is very interesting to me. Last year, I declare my income and simply didn't pay any tax. As of this year, I have departed the country and didn't even bother to file a return. This may be putting me in a difficult situation, so I intend to write to the taxman citing the 1682 Bill of Rights and the Nuremberg precedent. If I pay monies to criminals who have committed high treason and the supreme international crime then I am aiding and abetting their crimes. At the same time, by doing so, am I not giving validity to the non-existent contract you are challenging?

Antipholus Papps said...

Oops, that should read 1689!

Captain Ranty said...


Sure you are.

But the contract itself is invalid because you entered into it unwittingly. In law, the contract is null & void as it doesn't exist.

It is known as an invisible contract. I am discovering that there are many such invisible contracts in place.

None of them contain the most basic element: to wit, a piece of paper with two wet signatures.